Planning Across Boundaries
When we think about public planning, we tend to think on a small scale: the zoning of a neighborhood, road construction or a citywide sewer system. These planning functions are essential to building a livable community, but they’re mostly limited to a local area within a single jurisdiction.
Armando Carbonell thinks about planning on a much larger scale. He thinks in terms of megaregions — large, interconnected areas of urban cities and natural systems that cross county lines and, often, state boundaries.
Carbonell is the chairman of the department of planning and urban form at the Lincoln Institute of Land Policy in Cambridge, Mass., where he’s worked on national, regional and urban planning policies since 1999. He’s also a co-chair with America 2050, a national initiative to prepare for population growth over the next four decades.
On Nov. 1, Carbonell will be in Chattanooga as the second speaker in the George T. Hunter Lecture Series. Earlier this week, he and I spoke by phone about the concept of megaregions, some basic goals for strategic growth plans, and the challenges cities will face in the future.
Q: In the forward to Megapolitan America, you write about the origin of the megaregion. Population growth is a common theme in many planning discussions, but in 2004, you started looking at clustering population growth — that is, trends around specific geographic areas. Is that a fair way to describe it?
A: The first thing we did that was unusual was we picked the year 2050, and that’s a lot further out than people tend to look, although the census bureau does have projections out that far. But to get into the cluster thing, we took more specific data for counties. This was at the University of Pennsylvania. We had them buy the Woods & Poole data and projections. We sort of extended that out to 2050, so we would have a sense of where the relative growth and shrinkage was going to be in the country.
I think you get a picture out of that that shows that some parts of the country are going to grow a lot more. Some are probably going to continue to lose population. That has implications for urban form, cities, the environment, and how we use land. We used that as a starting point.
Q: How do you define the megaregion?
A: It’s a relatively new way of thinking about regions and space. I see it as including metropolitan areas, the regions around cities, in particular looking at the linkages among metropolitan areas — so that you get more than one city or metro, you get bunches of them — but within some natural context. The map of megaregions that I would use is a bit fuzzy, but they include cities, they include metropolitan areas, and they include large natural systems. What we try to do is not separate the urban function from the natural function. We try to see how they relate to each other.
To pick the one that’s closest to home for me, a classic megaregion is the whole northeast of the United States. That stretches from the Appalachians to the Atlantic Ocean. It includes all the big cities of the eastern seaboard and all the spaces in between.
Q: When you start to look at planning in this larger context — it goes across different boundaries in terms of cities, counties and states — what kind of new planning policies stand out as priorities that may not have been as obvious on a more traditional scale?
A: The most obvious has to do with what we call governance, as a part from government. Governance is how we make decisions across various boundaries. It’s the way most regional planners now like to think about the whole policy process. So for example in a multi-state megaregion, the first issue is that each state has a lot of control over land-use policy and, to a large extent, over transportation policy. These are two big drivers of development patterns and infrastructure. There is really no easy way to get states to work together across those boundaries that exist today.
We’ve been interested in the inner-city rail system and especially high-speed rail. Any time a rail line is going to pass through many states, many governors have something to say about it, but also many states’ departments of transportation. There’s opportunity for things to get uncoordinated. What one needs to think about are the methods by which people get together and work out their needs, that may be different in different states, in some compatible way that leads to a system that works. There’s sort of a built-in challenge to anything at that scale that’s essentially jurisdictional.
There is no entity that has authority over a megaregion, and we’re not proposing that there should be. It’s not like a super state. It’s a way of thinking across those boundaries about the things that need to be considered at that scale. And there are a few things that just seem obvious, like large transportation systems, large water systems, large energy systems that need to be thought about. Really the insight is that to plan effectively for certain needs, we need to get better at working across boundaries. I’d say that’s one of the specialties we’ve developed at the Lincoln Institute, is how to do that.
Q: When you’re working on projects that go across boundaries, like transportation or water quality, do they have to happen at a federal level? Or is there a way that cities can coordinate these policies in an effective way?
A: I think it goes in both directions. When we started thinking about this, we had an ambitious goal to think about national-scale plans. [But we] quickly stepped back from that and said, “That’s not really tenable.”
I think we learned something the more we looked at the situation: that the country’s not homogeneous. Megaregions probably represent the biggest scale that you could think about getting real consensus around in terms of real planning. So we started with a more bottom-up process where megaregions really need to get together and think about their needs and present those to the national government. But we really don’t see the national government telling megaregions what to do or creating the national directive to do this.
On the other hand, what we did see happening was that national government has the ability to spend money, or at least it used to. That is a great incentive for people to get together and do things. At different scales, we’ve seen this recently. The regional sustainability grants that have come out of HUD have brought together people who otherwise weren’t getting together to plan — in some cases across state lines. And that’s something we encourage them to consider: to think as big as possible in terms of federal inducements to large-scale regional planning. I think that can be a very positive role. And in the stimulus package, there was funding for high-speed rail development that made a big difference in terms of stimulating interest across state lines.
I’m not saying there is no federal role, but we generally would say that the most effective planning should come from the regions. There should be some consideration of national consequences and implications, and there’s certainly still great importance to national policy. But especially in difficult times like this, you can imagine more happening at the regional level than will happen at the national level.
Q: Right now, we’re in the process of putting together a large strategic growth plan that includes 16 counties across three different states. This kind of initiative has been done in other parts of the country. Your book, Regional Planning in America, highlights a few. In terms of doing that scale of planning, what are some basic goals that stakeholders, government and citizens should hope to get out of the process?
A: The very first thing is getting people to believe that they actually have some influence on the future, and that the thought of planning for a long time is even feasible. I think you have to break down a kind of resistance to the thought that the future is out of our hands — that citizens don’t have much to say about it or that planners don’t have much to say about it.
That’s the difficulty in any one of these initiatives, because there is a kind of fatalism and even a kind of negativism that sometimes creeps in — a sense that things are not going to be as good as they were in the past. I think it’s important, because there’s no reason to believe that’s true, to put that aside and give people a sense of the potential to have a positive effect on the future and to actually do things that will make life better in places, which is the overall goal that planners have.
Some of that has to do with what I’d call visualization. This amounts to showing the possible outcomes of different choices that people can make, often called scenarios, and helping them to see the better and the worse possibilities and the pathways that might lead to the better ones. This has to be conditioned by an understanding that we’re operating in an uncertain environment. There are a lot of ways of describing scenario planning, but one of them includes a sense that you can’t just pick the scenario you want. You really need to be prepared for different things to happen and consider what the most robust choices are that you can make — to open you up to the best opportunities, but also protect you from some of the worst things that could happen. It’s a little bit like hedging your bets.
I think the most sophisticated versions of this kind of long-range, large-scale planning include not just, “let’s just pick our favorite scenario and hope we can make it happen.” Which, you know, there’s some value in that actually. But I think even more valuable is to say, “What happens if energy prices go through the roof? What happens if the housing market stays down?” Consider some of the good or the bad things that might happen, and consider how different paths will fare if those things happen. Then say, “Hmm, maybe I might want to guard against that in some way.”
We’ve done some work on planning for climate change. One of the real challenges there is that nobody can say exactly how much or how quickly climate will change; we’re seeing effects of different sorts around the country. Helping people to think about how they can make the best choices — it’s not the right choice, because no one knows what that is — in terms of having the fewest regrets in the future with the path that they take. This really is a recognition that communities have different preferences for risk and assess things in different ways. You can’t really dictate a kind of mechanical solution to this. It’s not strictly a science and engineering problem. It’s a social activity to decide how to manage risk and how to think about some of the challenges in the future. Once communities can develop a vocabulary to talk about it, they can do great things in terms of getting people together to address things which otherwise might be scary or that you might just want to ignore.
Q: There’s been a resurgence of interest in cities over the last couple decades. Alex Krieger was here recently, and he talked about how Americans are moving back to cities. I want to ask about their role in these bigger systems, specifically the kind of challenges cities will face in the future.
A: I don’t know if we want to call it the Seinfeld phenomenon, but it seems that the popular cultural idea of cities — the stock has gone up tremendously.
I think there is a resurgence. I think there are demographic factors that will continue to feed that. I’m a classic baby boomer, and I walk to work. I went to a lot of trouble to live close enough to my office to do that. And I know lots of people who are like me, and there’s going to be bunches more. That’s one demographic feed going into cities. It’s a lifestyle choice, and it makes sense for us.
But there are also a lot of young people who have really been attracted to cities, in certain cities more than others. New York has just had this tremendous boom in young people coming in, rediscovering neighborhoods, and creating real estate value. And that affects one of the challenges: Desirable cities are very expensive places to live. That starts to limit their accessibility to people with ordinary means, and they really need to be accessible to lots of people. Housing is going to be a challenge in cities. Even cities like New York, which are thought of as pretty dense places, are thinking about how to increase intensity of use in places that are less so.
So finding space for people as cities continue to be popular is a challenge. And making housing affordable is a big challenge.
There’s also this differential [in that] some cities are growing, but some cities are still shrinking. The statistics out of the last census suggest that the Detroits and the Clevelands and others actually had done worse in between the two censuses than they thought.
The places that haven’t grown so much — and generally what is going on now is an acceptance that some of these places are not just going to grow back to their highest population numbers — need to think about an opportunity to reconfigure themselves around smaller population and think about how to better use the space of the city.
In Cleveland for example, things related to urban agriculture are going on in a pretty significant way. [They’re] dealing with empty lots and thinking about how to consolidate development as much as possible. I think there’s a new realism in some of the cities that have yet to completely stabilize that they’d be better off, in a sense, accepting the smaller population, trying to rework the infrastructure that they have, and think creatively about more green space and about more compact neighborhoods and encourage people to move into more logical clusters where they can do that.
People are working at this in serious and creative ways. I think it’s a new attitude, and it’s the realistic approach.
Another major challenge is climate change, which I think is the biggest challenge. It’s going to require us to rethink how we do a lot of things. Some places are going to be better prepared than others that haven’t taken it into account. I think this will be an inescapable phenomenon, and one that we’ve encouraged people to think about sooner and not later.
Q: Could you give us a preview of what to expect in your lecture next week?
A: Well, I don’t want to give it away too much, but I have been thinking about it. It’ll be a kind of excursion through a number of scales, so be prepared to get a little dizzy as I zoom up to the level of the planet and then down to something fairly microscopic. That’s kind of one of my themes. It may help as you embark on a regional initiative to think about how to think big and think small in a way that’s connected. I’ll also try to carry through my main idea, which has to do with the integration of cities and urbanism with natural systems. And I might end up on some suggestions on some pathways to a good life, which I think is not too much to ask that planners help us to build a good life for ourselves.